[South Korea No. 13]
Available in Vietnamese at www.atfnews.vn
Host：Hello Roger! Thank you for coming here!
I want to introduce Sandy, today host. Sandy Peng is Partner at Fission Capital. A HK based Blockchain innovation platform that invests and builds. Senior Advisor to BC Group (HK.863), the first listed institutional facing Blockchain company on the HK main board, with the first fully insured custody solution in Asia.
Sandy：Hi Roger, I’m your interviewer for today. We look forward to hearing about your time in the industry, and interesting stories along the way.
Roger：Thank you for hosting!
Sandy：。I think Roger needs no introduction. He is by far the most well known person in the early Bitcoin space. An early adopter, and avid advocate, an entrepreneur and an investor. His most famous accomplishments include Bitcoin.com, Supporter of BCH, and many more. So I can’t wait to get started.
When I first read about Bitcoin in 2013, I went on Youtube, and your videos were the most simple and succinct version of Satoshi’s Vision for me (Excuse the pun). Now the Bitcoin family is much more complicated if you had 30 seconds to explain Bitcoin to someone new to the industry today, what would you say?
Roger :I would give the same speech today, but change the word Bitcoin to Bitcoin Cash. Bitcoin Cash allows anyone, anywhere in the world to send or receive any amount of money with anyone else, instantly, basically for free, and there is nothing that anyone can do to stop it.
Sandy：That’s a great answer. But in today’s crypto landscape, it seems like there are a lot of tokens that claim to allow you to do that. Why Bitcoin Cash?
Roger：I’m a fan of all the tokens that work as peer to peer electronic cash. Some other great examples are Dash, Zcash, Zcoin, etc…
Sandy：If someone completely missed what happened in the last few years, how would you explain why the original fork happened? What were some of the major debates at play then?
Roger : That is a lot to cover. A whole book could be written on the topic, but a short summary is: One group of people didn’t think Bitcoin should be a peer to peer electronic cash system as described in the original white paper. Instead they wanted it to be used only as a “store of value”. They successfully took over the English speaking discussion platforms and used censorship and banning of anyone with a different point of view to hijack the BTC version of Bitcoin and delay the adoption of crypto CURRENCIES around the world. It breaks my heart to have watched the Bitcoin community be hijacked in this way, and new users to the ecosystem are still being deceived by the censorship to this very day.
Sandy:Wow, that is a very strong view. Thank you for sharing.
I would love to ask more about what you mean by “censorship”, but I want to stay focused on the scaling debate I think you alluded to. One side believes Bitcoin Should be kept, and one side believes Bitcoin should be spent.
Roger :If BTC isn’t a “peer to peer electronic cash system” then it isn’t Bitcoin.
If people want to read more about the censorship, there are some good summaries here:
Sandy：The concept of “velocity of money” is an interesting one. So you are on the side that believes the more “spending/ usage” the better? why is that?
Roger：I think that the only reason people would want to keep Bitcoin is if they know that they have the ability to spend it later. If you make it so you can’t spend Bitcoin, there isn’t any reason to keep Bitcoin.
I don’t think that people need to spend their crypto currency, but in order to want to hold their crypto currency, they need to have the ability to spend it when they want to. If it isn’t spendable, there isn’t any reason to hold it.
Sandy：If you think of Bitcoin as an equity (classic store of value), then the more people wanting to hold it, the more value it gains, is that correct？
Roger：On the censorship topic again, the effect that it has on people is stunning, due to censorship in China, it may be hard to view this video, but I think I did a good job explaining it here:
The best way for people to want to hold Bitcoin is if they know that they can spend it everywhere. The reason everyone wants to hold USD, or CNY is because they can spend them anywhere. If USD or CNY or KRW stopped being spendable, no one would want to hold them.
Sandy :Yup, that is very true. What do you think of Lightning as a potential solution?
Roger：There are 7,935 lightning users in the entire world. Bitcoin.com adds more new Bitcoin Cash users in a single day. I wish LN good luck, but it isn’t interesting to me because it isn’t usable in commerce reliably. Maybe someday that will change.
Sandy：I didn’t realise it then, but I think you must have been the first version of the so called “Crypto KOL”, but unlike all the other KOLs who are promoting different ICOs or IEOs, you always stick to one token, why is that?
Roger：I don’t know what a KOL is, but I like, hold, and promote lots of tokens. I currently like BCH the best because I think it has the best chance of improving the lives of the most number of people around the world by enabling more economic freedom. I’ll gladly promote whatever actually works to make people’s lives better.
Sandy：I see, as a BCH supporter, what would you say is BCH’s top priority right now? I’m asking you because I found this picture during my research.
Roger：I think that photo does a good job. Bitcoin Cash already has almost all of what it needs. Fast, Cheap, Private, Tokens, and passionate user base. I think we should just continue to focus on getting more people to actually use BCH for actual commercial transactions.
I really love the recent privacy upgrade to BCH thanks to cashshuffle.com, we will be adding this same feature to the Bitcoin.com wallet soon too.
Sandy：Where would you want to see BCH in one year’s time?
Roger：We are also focusing on attracting more developers by offering all sorts of SDKs to make it easier for people to build BCH apps at developer.bitcoin.com. We are working with a chain of about 3,000 physical shops in Japan. I look forward to all of them accepting BCH by this time next year. There are already more places in Japan accepting BCH than BTC.
Sandy :That’s fantastic! You’re probably the best person to explain BCH to new comers, and promote BCH payment to shop owners. What is the goal for say 10 years. 1 million shops?
Roger：I’m also very excited about the tokens being made on Bitcoin Cash. The first one from Liberland.org was just listed on an exchange earlier this week. We will also be adding full BCH token support to our 4 million Bitcoin.com wallets soon too. BCH already has over 100,000 online sites accepting it for payment. In 10 years I would like to see every new cell phone sold each day to come pre-installed with a BCH wallet. We are already in talks with several cell phone manufacturers about this.
Sandy：I think handset manufacturers for 3rd world countries are fairly fragmented. But first world market is dominated by some of the big players. What do you think is needed to say get Apple onboard for BCH pre installment?
Roger：Because there is no official crypto currency or BCH company, it is up to all of us to tell our friends and families, and help them setup wallets, and to start using it for payments every day. I think we will need for BCH to be so useful for so many people in so many countries that people couldn’t imagine not having it on their phone.
We saw this happen previously with google maps. Everyone loved using the maps on their iphone, so eventually Apple made their own and built it right into the OS. The same is possible for BCH in the future once enough people find it useful.
Sandy：So Facebook Coin, and JP Coin all the giant US companies that dominate some segment of the market are planning on coming into this space. With their clout and existing users, do you think BCH community can compete on the same level?
Roger :I don’t know. A lot of it will depend on the characteristics of Facebook coin, or JP coin. The coin that is the most useful will be used the most, but the network effect is a very important part of that. Facebook and JP Morgan will have large network effects from the very start.
Sandy:I hope this is ok to ask. Apart from your BCH work, you are known for some of your anarchist views, can you explain to me if/how that helps the BCH community?
Roger： I think the idea that all human interactions should be voluntary isn’t extreme at all. The idea that one small group of people get to use threats of violence to boss everyone else around is the extreme position that needs to be justified. I got involved in Bitcoin because I was already a voluntaryist, and so were most of the other early adopters. I see crypto currencies as a tool to take away power from people who want to use violence to control other people. If crypto currencies didn’t have that ability, I wouldn’t be interested in them.
So did my anarchist views help? I think they clearly did. Crypto currencies are a worldwide phenomenon today, and lots of new people have been exposed to the new ideas of voluntaryism because of that.
Sandy：That’s an interesting way to look at it. So some original members of the BCH community initiated another fork recently, and called it BSV. What are you views on that? It has been said that it took something away from the momentum of the BCH movement.
Roger：The BCH BSV split surely did delay the adoption of BCH, but I think both camps can work on the version of a coin that they like best. I wish the BSV people good luck with their project, but it isn’t something I’m interested in myself.
Sandy：Ok, I think we have only 10 minutes left with Roger. He has been super candid in sharing his views on the industry, and still one of the best communicator and thought leader in my opinion.
I have prepare some quick fire questions for Roger: 1. What is your idea of a BCH killer Dapp?
Roger：Cash!Tokens are pretty cool too.
The killer Dapp is peer to peer electronic cash. We already know this since it is what got Bitcoin started to begin with.
Sandy：Who is person that you most respect in this industry?
Roger：I think I respect Satoshi the most for inventing this amazing technology that we all get to benefit from.
For people who’s real identity is known, I think I appreciate the Bitpay founders the most for enabling so much commerce to take place using crypto currencies.
Sandy：As an early adopter, what would you say is the most valuable lesson you took from this journey?
Roger：Stephan and Tony are their names. They were super early too, and did an amazing job getting large merchants to start accepting bitcoin. The most valuable lesson I’ve learned would be to not underestimate the effectiveness of censorship upon shaping public opinion. The ongoing censorship within the Bitcoin community has had a giant effect on people’s views.
Sandy：Getting merchants to accept bitcoin is HARD! I tried a failed any times. If you can give me a sales line to regurgitate, what would that line be?
Roger：I think it was easier in the west with services like Bitpay. They allow merchants to accept payments from anyone, anywhere, instantly, with no risk of charge backs or payment fraud, and can do it much cheaper than credit cards.
I’m also super excited about local.bitcoin.com that we will be launching soon too. It will enable people all over the world to permissionlessly trade with each other.
Sandy：My last question: because we are in an all female blockchain chat group. Can you name a female blockchain entrepreneur you respect, and what would you say to get more young women involved in the industry?
Roger：。Of course I appreciate Sandy and Vivian for setting this up, and I’m also a fan or Star and Kiana for setting up crypto exchanges.
Sandy：And Roger I have a question. Is there any future plan expand to Korea? Adoption of BCH for Korea this year?
Roger：I enjoy Korea very very very much and would love to spend more time there and help drive more BCH adoption there. I’d also love the help of all the Koreans in this group too. If anyone doesn’t have any BCH yet, just install the Bitcoin.com wallet and DM or email me your BCH address and I will send you some to try. email@example.com
Sandy：And nowadays there is market rise up suddenly, what do you think about it?
Roger：I think adoption in commerce drives the price higher and higher, so I’m focusing on creating more adoption in commerce.
Sandy：Awesome:) Thank you so much for your time Roger!
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